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Max

01-11-2018 at 11:51 AM
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Combining PSN to PS4

I didn't want to derail the jrok conversation with this so I'm posting it here.

@Marcade I'm a bit confused. Are you saying that PSN and PS4 play differently and should not be combined or are you saying they play the same and should be combined?

I can't say that I have ever played both versions of any game on both platforms. I mean I'm sure I played some trials on PSN that I ended up buying, but I wasn't ever focused on game play differences.

I can say that I need a PS4 to play PSN games (assuming the PSN games are made for PS4 and not PS3).

It make no difference to me really other than if they play the same, it would be better to combine the two for ESI. I would defer to you or the other PSN/PS4 players to quantify if there is a difference.
Likes Cyriss_Zeal, Barra, HAN, RaGe, Fly and 1 others liked this post

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  1. Marcade's Avatar
    You took me out of context. heh.
    I was simply saying, similiar games from the past dont play identical.

    eg.I can download "Parappa the Rapper" on the PS4 - network. Enhanced graphics, added features, faster frame rate, and glitch free. However, it is not EXACTLY identical to the original on the PS1.
    Thanks Max, datagod thanked this post
  2. Marcade's Avatar
    Former refs in that era, @RaGe or @Barthax, can comment and elaberate more on why PS and PSN are separated platforms.

    If there is a CD/ and jewel case that exists for the game, the rule was it belongs in the PS format.
    If its only a "downloadable game" to be found, then it would be classified as a PS network game for that corresponding console .
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  3. Max's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Marcade
    You took me out of context. heh..
    Not intended... and explains a chunk of my initial confusion.
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  4. Marcade's Avatar
    You get it now...

    More examples:

    Pinball Arcade for the PS4. Majority of players simply download it, (even though it does exist as a seperate CD/disk. (therefore PS4 platform)

    Zen Pinball/FX3 - Does not have a known disk, only downloadable, therefore its PSN.
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  5. Max's Avatar
    Haha. I do get it now. Can't wait for a RaGeY response. :D
    Likes Marcade liked this post
  6. datagod's Avatar
    If we had retro style "threading", you would not have had to make your own wall post. I am compiling a list of reasons to preserve our forums...this is one of them.

    Thanks though for making a wall post.

    :)
    Likes Marcade, GibGirl, TRB_MetroidTeam liked this post
  7. Marcade's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Max
    Haha. I do get it now. Can't wait for a RaGeY response. :D
    In addition to "likes and thanks", there should be a click for "ALRIGHT" ! ;)
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  8. Max's Avatar
    I've got a neat twist for you Marc (and RaGe):

    I have a TPA disc but dowloaded all seasons over time.

    lol, are my season one games PS4 and all other downloaded TPA games PSN? :D
    Updated 01-11-2018 at 12:23 PM by Max
  9. Marcade's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Max
    I've got a neat twist for you Marc (and RaGe):

    I have a TPA disc but dowloaded all seasons over time.

    lol, are my season one games PS4 and all other games PSN? :D
    It doesnt matter what you have, its what exists out there. Agree?

    Unless you "prove" to me the downloads and the Disk plays differently, ya, we got a problem there!
    "DAMN it Jim, I'm just a doctor, not a miracle worker!!! Heh. ;)
  10. Max's Avatar
    It sounds like PS4 and PSN games (made for PS4 play) should be combined. I'll patiently await RaGeY's response.

    I don't think they play differently at all but I can't prove or disprove that.
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  11. Marcade's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Max
    It sounds like PS4 and PSN games (made for PS4 play) should be combined. I'll patiently await RaGeY's response.

    I don't think they play differently at all but I can't prove or disprove that.
    I would not mind it, in a classifying sense. Just as long as there is a separate column for it on the scoreboard. Like MAME, which now has its versions. Agree?

    That could be very time consuming for TG to do this. Would not hold my breath.
  12. GibGirl's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Marcade
    I would not mind it, in a classifying sense. Just as long as there is a separate column for it on the scoreboard. Like MAME, which now has its versions. Agree?

    That could be very time consuming for TG to do this. Would not hold my breath.
    So, why should they even be distinguished via a column? What benefit is there to the TG scoreboards to know whether a game can only be downloaded, or if there's a disc that could be purchased?
  13. Max's Avatar
    I think there are two concepts going on here.

    I don't think Papa the Rapper for PS1 DL should be combined.

    I do think that PSN games made for PS4 should be combined with PS4 as they should both be identical digital files. In this instance, no additional column would be needed.

    I'm easily confused though. ;D
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    Updated 01-11-2018 at 01:15 PM by Max
  14. sdwyer138's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Max
    I think there are two concepts going on here.

    I don't think Papa the Rapper for PS1 DL should be combined.

    I do think that PSN games made for PS4 should be combined with PS4 as they should both be identical digital files. In this instance, no additional column would be needed.

    I'm easily confused though. ;D
    I agree with all of what you are saying here.
  15. Snowflake's Avatar
    Also agree with the above two. Similiarly, I dont think anyone would say super mario bros 3 in the wii virtual console should be combined with the NES track, but i could see it categorized as regular wii as opposed to wii vritual console.

    I'm not sure how important merging platforms is. Unlike merging tracks, which should be controversial, merging platforms hardly matter. heck, there could be no platforms and just let track rules dictate everything. The only real reasons for merging platform or seperating platforms, if it you care about competing on ESI (i wouldnt mind seeing neo geo split for that reason, as its kind of its own thing), or if you just care about ease of sorting and finding games. We have a lot of platforms, so many, that i think merging would be healthy, since at some points, to many folders start to need their own folders.

    I've suggested before maybe we should have another level of granularity? right now it goes platform> game > track. maybe it should be platfrom family > platform > game > track. Put arcade, arcade SD, jrok, even mame all in the same "platform family".

    I also get this isnt a huge priority, since honestly, it doesnt matter a whole lot either way. Merging individaul tracks though, that does matter a lot and deserves alot of debate.
  16. Marcade's Avatar
    Does anyone think Arcade and MAME should be combined?

    I say no, but some members in the past and present here say it should. (categorized)

    Lets face it, M.A.M.E. aint the "S.A.M.E."



    In the case of PS4 and PSN merging together into one, like I said it couldnt hurt, but the damage is already done. It already out there as is. (Just like EMU can be found under C64, 2600, and others)

    (Sure, I wouldnt mind either case, BUT as long as the title of the track clearly says what it is, categorized within)
    Likes Max liked this post
    Updated 01-11-2018 at 01:58 PM by Marcade
  17. Max's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowflake

    I also get this isnt a huge priority.
    It's not a priority at all, rather just a topic born out of the jrok thread.

    With that in mind, the less platforms the better. It makes for a more dense competitive playfield. It makes for less dilution.
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  18. Snowflake's Avatar
    MAME is another one, where i wouldnt mind it being under the same platform, but different tracks. Much like atari has emu under the general atari platform, yet emu tracks, ntsc tracks, and pal tracks are all seperate. I'd have no ojbect to an arcade track that read "arcade> donkey kong> mame > no hammer" for example. as for merging, it would have to be a case by case basis. some games play the same (i think) some dont (i'm sure). It would make a real headache keeping track of which MAMEs are perfect emulation and which arent, so better to keep all the tracks seperate
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  19. Max's Avatar
    The topic of mame would need it's own wall post so Datagod can file it appropriately. :D

    There are a bunch of mame games that are identical, though with regret, too many games are not identical. That would be an endless nightmare to sort through I reckon.

    Back to PS4/PSN, all the TPA players just received an automated upgrade/update a day or two ago. I would hazard a guess that every single TPA upgrade for all users, disc or not, contain identical data per game and system.
    Likes datagod liked this post
    Updated 01-11-2018 at 02:11 PM by Max
  20. GibGirl's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowflake
    MAME is another one, where i wouldnt mind it being under the same platform, but different tracks. Much like atari has emu under the general atari platform, yet emu tracks, ntsc tracks, and pal tracks are all seperate. I'd have no ojbect to an arcade track that read "arcade> donkey kong> mame > no hammer" for example. as for merging, it would have to be a case by case basis. some games play the same (i think) some dont (i'm sure). It would make a real headache keeping track of which MAMEs are perfect emulation and which arent, so better to keep all the tracks seperate
    My ideal around this would be some sort of subcategorization - just like NTSC and PAL should be subcategories of a track where relevant, so should EMU. You could view scores for all the categories, or just some. Maybe I'll just view arcade DK scores, maybe just EMU, or maybe both together.

    ESI could still be tracked separately. And someone can have a score in both subcategories - but only get ESI from whichever one is worth the most. (say you have first place in Arcade, 5th in EMU, but EMU has a lot more scores, so you only the ESI from EMU added to your total)

    One bonus from this would be that adding a track in the category would automatically add all of the subcategories that are relevant. Add a new game to a console, and you get both NTSC and PAL where there's a distinction - and EMU for all the consoles that support it.

    I'm sure there are issues that would need to be ironed out, and I suspect the implementation is non-trivial. Just feels like a usability and categorization improvement that would be great to see in the future.
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