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Dispute: Dick Moreland - Atari 2600 / VCS - Dragster - NTSC - Game 1, Difficulty B [Fastest Time] - Player: Todd Rogers - Score: 05.51

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Is this a valid dispute?

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  1. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 23,017
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    I got to give you credit for trying, Dick, but I'm feeling that this dispute will be an epic failure.

    Anyway........

    there is video proof in the form of a TAS that this time is not possible. http://tasvideos.org/5517S.html
    What that video and the analysis also finds is that 5.57 IS possible, YET no one has even got that time either. How do you guys explain that?
    Here's how I explain it.....you're not trying hard or for long enough?





    john


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    5.57 on this game is definitely possible as proven by a TAS run.
    This is why I thought it was important for Omnigamer to post the dispute - no one is more qualified to explain the evidence or has a more thorough understanding than him.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WCopeland View Post
    5.57 on this game is definitely possible as proven by a TAS run.
    This is why I thought it was important for Omnigamer to post the dispute - no one is more qualified to explain the evidence or has a more thorough understanding than him.
    John I really dont understand what no one getting the 5.57 means? I would feel it validates the points Omni made in his post regarding the TAS. Anyway I 100% concur with Wes and hope Omni will get involved in the discussion.
    Dan Desjardins
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    I'm sorry. I have to vote this one down. There is verified evidence from Activision that Todd achieved this score. A quick google search will pull that up. I won't bore you all with it here. (If you want me to I will.)

    As far as the TAS, it is just that a tool-assisted speedrun. They do not take the human element into consideration at all. If anyone has played this game for longer than an hour you know that it takes a great amount of skill and timing to play at an elite level.
    Mike Estep
    Columbus, OH
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    Quote Originally Posted by So_Unclear View Post
    I'm sorry. I have to vote this one down. There is verified evidence from Activision that Todd achieved this score. A quick google search will pull that up. I won't bore you all with it here. (If you want me to I will.)

    As far as the TAS, it is just that a tool-assisted speedrun. They do not take the human element into consideration at all. If anyone has played this game for longer than an hour you know that it takes a great amount of skill and timing to play at an elite level.
    Did you read ANY of Omni's explanation on that "verified evidence"? He has provided a lot of information. The code of the game was analyzed it has nothing to do with the TAS or not.
    Dan Desjardins
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  6. VERIFIED VERIFIED Credibility: 1,039
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    Yes I did read Omnigamers "explanation" of it.

    Not to start a pissing match but this is the same guy that put a Google spreadsheet out and said prove me wrong, and when someone did he changed the equations to make the math not work out right. So no matter what you put in it made the times impossible.

    So I believe nothing he writes or his theories on this game.

    Doubt And Drama Still Haunt An Old, And Seemingly Impossible Atari World Record.

    David Crane said that Activision was stringent about its own high-score record-keeping. “Activision used photographic evidence, requiring a Polaroid photo of the TV screen,” he said. “This was pre-internet, and pre-Photoshop. It would have been very difficult to falsify a Polaroid photo.”

    I will not reply to this any more unless asked to show Activisions evidence.


    Mike Estep
    Columbus, OH
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    Quote Originally Posted by So_Unclear View Post
    Yes I did read Omnigamers "explanation" of it.

    Not to start a pissing match but this is the same guy that put a Google spreadsheet out and said prove me wrong, and when someone did he changed the equations to make the math not work out right. So no matter what you put in it made the times impossible.

    So I believe nothing he writes or his theories on this game.

    Doubt And Drama Still Haunt An Old, And Seemingly Impossible Atari World Record.

    David Crane said that Activision was stringent about its own high-score record-keeping. “Activision used photographic evidence, requiring a Polaroid photo of the TV screen,” he said. “This was pre-internet, and pre-Photoshop. It would have been very difficult to falsify a Polaroid photo.”

    I will not reply to this any more unless asked to show Activisions evidence.


    1. I dont know anything about changing the equations so Omni will have to respond to that. If so that makes for some concerns regarding his current conclusions.

    2. That article also states that Todd himself says two other 5.51 scores were invalidated from Activision does it not? "Rogers says that the other two scores were “disqualified.”"

    3. Do you have Activision's Evidence?
    Dan Desjardins
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    Would you be able to provide a hyperlink to the situation you're alluding to above? I started to read about Omnigamer's analysis of Dragster over the last couple of days here at TG, and I would appreciate the chance to read into things further.
  9. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 1,687
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    @So_Unclear - sorry, there was another post before mine appeared, just wanted to clarify who my message was directed at
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  10. VERIFIED VERIFIED Credibility: 1,039
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    Quote Originally Posted by danman1234 View Post
    3. Do you have Activision's Evidence?
    Sorry didn't mean evidence, but validation from their own publication.

    Like I said before a simple google search can find this.

    This is good enough for me.

    I will leave you all with this from the article above.

    “Activision validated Todd’s Dragster score using the accepted methods of the day,” Crane said. “The time to question any of those records has passed.”



    5.51.jpg
    Good luck in your venture. I have submitted my vote.
    Good day.
    Mike Estep
    Columbus, OH
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