thread

Dispute: Andrew Mee - SNES / SFC - Battletoads & Double Dragon: The Ultimate Team - NTSC - Points - Player: Paul J. Tesi - Score: 1,629,250

User Tag List

Is this a valid dispute?

This poll is closed
    This poll is closed
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 17
  1. VERIFIED Honored Veteran Credibility: 27,373


    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    No' 'ere
    Posts
    20,179
    Thanks (Received)
    6544
    Likes (Received)
    6417
    Blog Entries
    133
    Live Streaming Channel(s)
    View Channel: barthax
    Mentioned
    108 Post(s)
    Tagged
    48 Thread(s)
    Follows
    86
    Following
    78

    Dispute: Andrew Mee - SNES / SFC - Battletoads & Double Dragon: The Ultimate Team - NTSC - Points - Player: Paul J. Tesi - Score: 1,629,250

    SNES / SFC - Battletoads & Double Dragon: The Ultimate Team - NTSC - Points
    Score Trackhttp://www.twingalaxies.com/scores.php?scores=73990
    RulesFactory Default [No Continues!]
    Special Rules: None.
    Player NamePaul J. Tesi
    Original Adjudicationhttp://www.twingalaxies.com/showthread.php?t=147998
    Verification MethodTGSAP
    Verification Date2015-10-07
    Disputed Score1,629,250 (Rank 1)
    Disputed ByBarthax
    Dispute Evidence / RationaleThis run was a clear case of leeching. The original adjudication seemed to fall under a spell of "well the other guy _must_ have leeched so it'll be all OK to accept". Shortly after the adjudication was accepted, a thread popped up showing the original run: it wasn't leeching. http://www.twingalaxies.com/showthre...-points-record .

    This run should never have been accepted - two thirds of the points score was obtained on the final boss fight without attempting to progress in the game.
    Likes Barra liked this post
  2. VERIFIED Honored Veteran Credibility: 27,373


    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    No' 'ere
    Posts
    20,179
    Thanks (Received)
    6544
    Likes (Received)
    6417
    Blog Entries
    133
    Live Streaming Channel(s)
    View Channel: barthax
    Mentioned
    108 Post(s)
    Tagged
    48 Thread(s)
    Follows
    86
    Following
    78
    The disputed run, reaches the final boss-lady around 35:35 and stays on that screen until the end around 1:51:00 - nearly 1 hour 20 minutes of leeching.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpWd...ature=youtu.be

    The current #2 run where PJ reaches the final boss around 40:10 and dispatches her around 44:37.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Zce...ature=youtu.be

    Are you on my radar?
    I'd rather be last on every game than throw my time away chasing only one score.
    Thanks HugDD thanked this post
    Likes Barra liked this post
  3. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 5,024
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,602
    Thanks (Received)
    707
    Likes (Received)
    1071
    Blog Entries
    22
    Mentioned
    13 Post(s)
    Tagged
    63 Thread(s)
    Follows
    36
    Following
    15
    Looked at original adjudication thread where said player admits it was leeching. Voting yes
    Thanks Lauren R. Tyler thanked this post
    Likes Barthax, Barra, Lauren R. Tyler liked this post
  4. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 4,803
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Charlottetown, PE, Canada
    Posts
    2,267
    Thanks (Received)
    332
    Likes (Received)
    516
    Blog Entries
    1
    Live Streaming Channel(s)
    View Channel: d3scride
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Follows
    52
    Following
    26
    I agree that's totally leeching, but is there a finite amount of point pressing you're allowed to do on this boss? How is it defined?
    Craig Rout Gallant

    Current verified TG WRs: 58

    My Youtube channel: http://www.youtube.com/CraigARG
    MAME World Records channel: http://www.youtube.com/MAMEWorldRecords
  5. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 7,875
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Vermilion, Ohio
    Posts
    5,064
    Thanks (Received)
    2159
    Likes (Received)
    3677
    Blog Entries
    112
    Live Streaming Channel(s)
    View Channel: snowflaketg
    Mentioned
    75 Post(s)
    Tagged
    33 Thread(s)
    Follows
    46
    Following
    23
    This is an awkward one. Some players were fine with the leeching and dont like the leeching rule. The big issue here for me though, was other players, who were not fine with the leeching rule may have accepted based on the false information that there was no other way for previous number one to get the score he got. This information was later proven false, but was a key piece of information to get the score accepted. For that reason alone I think this needs to be readjudicated. Remove the score, but allow Paul to resubmit if he likes with the correct information, and if adjudicators are still ok with the score with no false information provided so be it.
    Mr. Do's Castle champ
    Lode Runner champ
    Other kid's games champ

    Adult Games: Street Fighter champ
  6. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 1,003
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Posts
    118
    Thanks (Received)
    37
    Likes (Received)
    92
    Blog Entries
    1
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Follows
    3
    Following
    4
    The runner himself stated that he didn't want to be associated with leeching and regretted that he misled people about PJ's scores. Even if this weren't the case, the rules (global rules? implied rules? this part has me confused a little) at the time of submission stated that leeching was prohibited. Even if there was suspicion about PJ's score, it's presence on the leaderboard should have been evidence that it was legitimate, as has been the running theme in recent dispute threads.

    Voting yes. This run should not have been accepted under the rules at the time of submission. If people want leeching to be allowed, that discussion should take place separately, rather than just voting to slide in leeching scores under the radar and then pointing to them and saying "THIS RUN LEECHED, YOU HAVE TO LET ME DO THE SAME THING NOW"
    Likes Barthax, CWK, Megaretroman liked this post
  7. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 5,644
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Wellington, New Zealand
    Posts
    2,496
    Thanks (Received)
    489
    Likes (Received)
    1172
    Blog Entries
    1
    Live Streaming Channel(s)
    View Channel: BarraNZ
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Tagged
    5 Thread(s)
    Follows
    35
    Following
    22
    Just went to dispute this one not realising there was one open already

    Voting yes - a clear case of leeching here.
    Likes Barthax, CWK liked this post
  8. VERIFIED VERIFIED Credibility: 10,341
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    1,448
    Thanks (Received)
    680
    Likes (Received)
    1120
    Blog Entries
    7
    Mentioned
    41 Post(s)
    Tagged
    9 Thread(s)
    Follows
    40
    Following
    4
    Leeching bad therefore this submission is bad, I"m voting yes
  9. VERIFIED COMMISSIONER Credibility: 8,000
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    Leigh-On-Sea, UK
    Posts
    227
    Thanks (Received)
    251
    Likes (Received)
    442
    Blog Entries
    11
    Mentioned
    45 Post(s)
    Tagged
    3 Thread(s)
    Follows
    17
    Following
    6
    It is possible this track is conceptually flawed.

    It’s a game with an ending, so the only way to go for the most points possible is to use leeching. Anti-leeching rules make it impossible to judge one score against another. How many points you should be allowed to get from the final boss for it to not be considered leeching? At this point it all becomes too subjective. What if a player was very close to the record but had to hit the final boss ‘one time too many’ to beat it?

    It might be more appropriate for a game like this, with an ending, could be done as a speedrun or a marathon, allowing leeching to gain as many points as possible.

    What does everyone think about this?
  10. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 7,875
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Vermilion, Ohio
    Posts
    5,064
    Thanks (Received)
    2159
    Likes (Received)
    3677
    Blog Entries
    112
    Live Streaming Channel(s)
    View Channel: snowflaketg
    Mentioned
    75 Post(s)
    Tagged
    33 Thread(s)
    Follows
    46
    Following
    23
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Hawksett View Post
    It is possible this track is conceptually flawed.

    It’s a game with an ending, so the only way to go for the most points possible is to use leeching. Anti-leeching rules make it impossible to judge one score against another. How many points you should be allowed to get from the final boss for it to not be considered leeching? At this point it all becomes too subjective. What if a player was very close to the record but had to hit the final boss ‘one time too many’ to beat it?

    It might be more appropriate for a game like this, with an ending, could be done as a speedrun or a marathon, allowing leeching to gain as many points as possible.

    What does everyone think about this?
    I'm not sure what the game having an ending has to do with it. Just because there's no other way to get a higher score doesnt make it ok. I mean if someone said "this is the maxout, the only way to get a high score is cheat" would that make it ok just because its the only way? In this case I dont think its subjective at all. He entered into a loop that can be carried out infinitely. Anything that can be done infinitely (other than progression, or something forced by the game) is leeching (unless people decide the leeching is so hard its cool). In cases of that I've sometimes see the rule say you can only do it once, sometimes see it say 3 times. In this particular case, the infinite loop is possible due to winning guys the same way numerous times. Duck tales deals with numerous lives by saying each one up can only be gathed once, as do many other games. I'd say how many lives you have when you first meet the boss is how many you can use. Any lives earned during the boss battle is part of an infinite loop and therefore not usable.
    Mr. Do's Castle champ
    Lode Runner champ
    Other kid's games champ

    Adult Games: Street Fighter champ
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Join us