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Dispute: John McAllister - M.A.M.E. - Domino Man - Points - Player: Clay W W Karczewski - Score: 1,183,760

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Is this a valid dispute?

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  1. VERIFIED VERIFIED Credibility: 10,302
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    Dispute: John McAllister - M.A.M.E. - Domino Man - Points - Player: Clay W W Karczewski - Score: 1,183,760

    M.A.M.E. - Domino Man - Points
    Score Trackhttp://www.twingalaxies.com/scores.php?scores=7720
    RulesROMSet: Domino
    Service Mode: Off
    Cabinet: Upright
    Internal Defaults
    -----------------

    1 Credit For: 3 Men
    Difficulty: 3
    1st Extra Man At: 25000 Points
    Additional Man Every: 40000 Points
    Special Rules: None
    Player NameClay W W Karczewski
    Original Adjudicationhttp://www.twingalaxies.com/showthread.php?t=160663
    Verification MethodTGSAP
    Verification Date2016-08-25
    Disputed Score1,183,760 (Rank 2)
    Disputed Byredelf
    Dispute Evidence / RationaleNo skill required Leeech fest leeching is banned
  2. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 4,803
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    This one I actually don't agree on. While the technique is "*****", even Donald admits (http://www.twingalaxies.com/showthre...lay-Karczewski) it cannot be done indefinitely so it certainly falls under the definition of point pressing. This is no different than other games like Metal Gear Solid where similar techniques are employed. If Donald wants the track to remain competitive, maybe a single life variation or 5-man should be created.
    Craig Rout Gallant

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  3. VERIFIED VERIFIED Credibility: 10,302
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    When no progress in a game is being made then I would say it's leeching. If the game had an ending and this same technique was being done I would say it's point pressing. When it's used because you can't play the game normally because you don't have the skill level to play the game as it was meant to then it's leeching. If you have the skill to play the game to it's conclusion then you have the right to leech for points before you finish the game. It shouldn't be allowed to sacrifice your lives and not make progress to just get a higher score, there's no point in playing the game then.
  4. VERIFIED VERIFIED Credibility: 10,302
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    I propose that a new track be created by TG and that Dons and this score be moved to that track that allows leeching.
    Then do some editing of the rules on this track specifying that no leeching will be allowed "can't topple the same domino over and over again" must be making progress to finish the level.
  5. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 4,803
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    Quote Originally Posted by redelf View Post
    When no progress in a game is being made then I would say it's leeching. If the game had an ending and this same technique was being done I would say it's point pressing. When it's used because you can't play the game normally because you don't have the skill level to play the game as it was meant to then it's leeching. If you have the skill to play the game to it's conclusion then you have the right to leech for points before you finish the game. It shouldn't be allowed to sacrifice your lives and not make progress to just get a higher score, there's no point in playing the game then.
    It's not leeching though since it can't be done indefinitely as Don has stated. Is it a ***** tactic? Sure. Also having a "right to leech" is ridiculously subjective and would not allow equal opportunity for all competitors. Why not just make a 5-man or 1-man [Extreme Settings] track? That would make for a more competitive track.
    Craig Rout Gallant

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    M.A.M.E. - Domino Man - [Extreme - 1 Life] - Points




    ROMSet: Domino
    Service Mode: Off
    Cabinet: Upright
    Internal Defaults
    -----------------


    1 Credit For: 3 Men
    Difficulty: 3
    1st Extra Man At: 25000 Points
    Additional Man Every: 40000 Points


    Special Rules: This is a 1 life ONLY variation. Your game ends after you lose your first man.

    This eliminates any of the aforementioned "leeching/point pressing" and is a better display of skill with very clear rules.
    Craig Rout Gallant

    Current verified TG WRs: 58

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    A terrible game ruined with a terrible technique.

    Restricting lives is the only way to go here
  8. VERIFIED Senior Member Credibility: 7,863
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    The debate already happened in the thread, adjudicators were aware of the tactic, and the old official leeching rules were linked. At least by the the old rules, if it cant be done forever its not leeching. You could argue for a new definition of leeching, or that its against the spirit of the game, but it is not leeching according to the official leeching rules.
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    I already argued this. Nothing against CWK but yes it absolutely is leeching. I dont care if you "die" while doing it. I hated this when it was done and i agree completely but for some reason people seem to think just getting points and not even TRYING to progress in the game is "point pressing" and eventually dying means its ok to do something for hours because "well there is a timer". Trying to compare 8 seconds of foot jumps in Donkey Kong to something like this was frustrating back then as well :). Not going to rehash it all but common sense needs to apply and doing something for 40 seconds is a lot different vs 45 minutes. Lives or not but alas that is where we ended up.
    Dan Desjardins
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    This really adresses another issue, how are disputes dealt with when zero no information is bought up? It was already called leeching, nothing new there, I could relink to the official defintion of leeching to prove its not, nothing new there either. So when a debate is reopened with zero no data are there going to be any rules on that?

    I'm not saying its never justified. Obviously in an extreme case its imaginable someone might claim double their actual scores and get their friends to push the bogus score through despite a few adjudicators at the time pointing out whats happening. In that case even though zero new data came forth it would still be right to challenge it. I believe we also had a real example of something submitted to the wrong track, it was pointed out at the time, but blind voters pushed it through anyway, it was definitely right to challenge that. Think of the other extreme though. Anytime an vote doesnt go someone's way do we want them to just reopening the debate all over?

    Its one thing when new info becomes available to challenge. But when zero new info is added, just the same old argument is brought up, we might want to consider in general how we want to deal with that.
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