Dispute: Jeremy Young - Arcade - Donkey Kong - Points [Hammer Allowed] - Player: Billy L Mitchell - Score: 1,062,800


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Is this a valid dispute?

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This poll is closed
  1. 09-19-2019, 06:16 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowflake View Post
    walter said a lot of things in that letter that contradicted other things in that letter as well as contradicting younger Walter of the forums. The Walter that signed that letter essentially called the Walter we all know a liar by denying his old numerous posts. Why would I trust the writer of the Walter letter after he bashed a nice guy like Walter so mercilessly?
    Do you still suspect Triforce's hand in the letter?
    Been playing games since 1975
    Creator of Arcade Retro Clock


  2. 09-19-2019, 06:20 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by datagod View Post
    Do you still suspect Triforce's hand in the letter?
    my speculation on the writer is irrelevant. At this point all parties had a chance to recant or claim forgery

    at this point they know what their signature is attached to. It’s on them
    Roy was Right
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  3. 09-19-2019, 09:39 PM
    Can't believe I'm addressing Datagod, but here goes:

    My suggestion to watch the three episodes of "Serial Killers" on Netflex was to show the process that goes on in a pathological liar's mind. You don't have to be a serial killer to be a pathological liar. However, when you watch these convicts sit there and come up with contradictory excuses and lie after lie for every aspect of the mountain of evidence against them, you can't help but draw comparisons to Billy's constantly evolving lines of lies. There's an answer for everything, and if it's debunked, the answer adjusts to be more vague or simply a new deflection is put up.

    Even you have to admit Billy's story keeps changing the more we home in on hard evidence. Think about a few examples of the defenses he's gone through:

    1. I've never heard of MAME, so I couldn't possibly have played on it.
    2. The tapes are NOT MAME.
    3. The tapes ARE MAME, but Dwayne did it to frame me (and we can prove it).
    4. The tapes are doctored, my scores were done live (and we can prove it).
    5. I never submit scores via tape.
    6. (deletes tweet about never submitting scores via tape).

    So come on dude, open your eyes and realize the man is lying his butt off. Had he been telling the truth from the beginning, the story would not change. Note his tech has done the same crap about what hardware they used to make the recordings, wasting everyone's time by changing that story as well.


    4.
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  4. 09-19-2019, 10:02 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by FBX View Post
    Can't believe I'm addressing Datagod, but here goes:
    Even you have to admit Billy's story keeps changing the more we home in on hard evidence. Think about a few examples of the defenses he's gone through:
    ...
    So come on dude, open your eyes and realize the man is lying his butt off.
    4.
    A) I never said Billy didn't lie.
    2) "lying his butt off" is far less offensive than "is pathological liar", which is all I was asking for.
    iii) "Even you". Even me? What did I do? All I did was ask people to stop using offensive and demeaning terms.

    All I am asking is for people to stick to the evidence and not turn this into a general "wah wah we hate Billy!" club. Look at the evidence, make up your own mind. I did that when the evidence was first introduced.

    The world is reading, and I would rather Twin Galaxies be seen as a place for rational discussion than an angry cesspool.

    But if you disagree, please carry on. Scream and yell, put words into people's mouths. Keep polluting this dispute thread with your own folk stories about how poorly you and your brother were treated when you tried to fight the corruption.

    -- END OF LINE --
    Been playing games since 1975
    Creator of Arcade Retro Clock


  5. 09-19-2019, 10:10 PM
    Since Roy's name keeps coming up, I just want to say, it amuses me greatly that I actually live in a universe where Roy Shildt is in better standing with Twin Galaxies than Billy Mitchell is.

    https://www.twingalaxies.com/scores.php?player=48987

    (That's Roy Shildt's score page, though it doesn't seem to be labeled as such. Also, TG misspells his name as "Roy Schildt". And even then, that's still better standing than Billy.)
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  6. 09-19-2019, 11:43 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by datagod View Post
    Everyone wants to hear Billy explain things, but if he ever came here he would likely be pounced on by a bunch of wild dogs.
    Bill. I'm calling BS on what you said above.
    In 13+ years of ME reading just about every forum post (when there was forums) never have I seen a post by Mitchell!
    I wondered years ago how come such a pathological self promoter could resist the urge to brag about how good he is to an interested captive audience.

    I now suspect that he never regularly posted incase he was inevitably caught out with a sticky question from another forum member!

    In other words...he never posted when he was a hero, WTF would he post now that he's nothing!



    john

    .
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  7. 09-20-2019, 01:04 AM
    While I was poking around the evidence, I came back across the old claim that the fake videos at Boomers (which Billy chose to participate in) were at the behest of Rob Childs in an attempt to build his YouTube channel. At least, that's their given reason for them being published, just in case anyone were to mistakenly think they were provided as supplemental public validation of two scores which Billy and his friends were claiming happened on an arbitrary night without warning and without other evidence.

    Obviously they felt the need to give some reason for the staged videos, other than "I dunno, just cuz, I guess." But it's interesting, this claim that Rob Childs was looking to build his YouTube channel. Here's that channel, as it is seen today:

    https://www.youtube.com/user/galaga2084/videos

    Name:  38 - Rob Childs YouTube.png
Views: 100
Size:  933.4 KB

    The video in the top right, titled "After DK record..." is the one in which the audio was replaced with royalty-free music.

    There doesn't really seem to be any earnest attempt at "building" anything there. There are a total of 14 videos, a full half of which feature Billy prominently, while others feature related topics (King of Kong arcade, Retro Arcade Night, and Billy's buddy Chris Ayra). Subsequent to the Boomers videos, you see two videos in the span of an entire year, and only two more since then. Note that a significant number of views on these videos had to have come since the dispute last year, when the Boomers videos in particular were scrutinized for evidence. The videos not related to Billy or the dispute have much less traffic, with one video having as few as 50 views.

    This doesn't necessarily mean Rob Childs wasn't at one point looking to build up a presence on YouTube, only to give up later. It's just interesting how one of their excuses for sketchy behavior yet again doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Rob Childs' YouTube channel actually resembles my own a bit, which for me is simply a place to upload videos I have an interest in publishing, with no thought given to "building" anything. For comparison, here's my channel, with the most recent video being my phone interview of Robert Mruczek conducted six months ago:

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7g...PbJCaqQ/videos

    Name:  39 - ersatz_cats YouTube.png
Views: 100
Size:  597.3 KB

    It should also be noted that, between Billy and Robert Childs, only one of them had a YouTube channel to upload videos to at the time in question. Billy's channel was created May 24, 2018, as part of him rebuilding his online presence in the wake of his sacking by TG and Guinness. And that channel still consists only of the three million-point games he did on Twitch last year:

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCL5...4gP47Cg/videos

    Name:  40 - Billy YouTube.png
Views: 100
Size:  1.14 MB

    I'm just stating the obvious at this point. But the actual circumstances much more closely resemble "Billy and friends uploaded these videos to give credence to these two scores they're claiming he achieved when those videos were filmed" rather than "We just wanted to help build up Rob's YouTube channel with videos that should not in any way be considered relevant to any questions related to the Boomers score despite any claims made therein."
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  8. 09-20-2019, 01:32 AM
    And don't forget we're not supposed to assume the faked board swap video was "nearly satire" ONLY after we proved it was faked. During the whole time the video was up before then, they never once admitted to it being fake and for promotional purposes only. But if you're a fan of Billy's like Datagod, stuff like that just is totally believable to you. No wrong doing, all in good fun.
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  9. 09-20-2019, 03:16 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by ersatz_cats View Post
    I'm just stating the obvious at this point. But the actual circumstances much more closely resemble "Billy and friends uploaded these videos to give credence to these two scores they're claiming he achieved when those videos were filmed" rather than "We just wanted to help build up Rob's YouTube channel with videos that should not in any way be considered relevant to any questions related to the Boomers score despite any claims made therein."
    100%. I'm cutting and pasting from a gstrain post on page 208:

    "For some historical context, the 3 Boomers videos were uploaded to YouTube by his friend Robert Childs on 8/7/2010, which was the same day the scores were unveiled during the International Video Game Hall of Fame induction of Billy Mitchell."

    Here's a link to the TG Archive to a thread about the "rumor" of Mitchell's new record, and its eventual revelation. The appearance of the videos for the first time are referenced therein:

    https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthr...-the-DK-record

    It's patently clear the purpose of the videos were to substantiate Mitchell's claim that these scores were attained in a live public venue a week earlier. Keep in mind that with the 1.05million score, that made for two Mitchell gameplay recordings that were done via direct feed without any footage of the venue, machine, set-up, DIP switches, etc - this could all be avoided if one had a TG referee there to witness the event. I think we can all imagine the reaction back then to the legitimacy of Mitchell's score if Childs explicitly prefaced the board swap as a loving satirical re-enactment when the videos first dropped.

    Ultimately, despite Mitchell's attempt to deflect responsibility to Childs, it's completely incongruous for an individual who styles themselves as a professional, veteran world class arcade champion ("Video Game Player of the Century") to permit themselves to engage in satire 'cause Childs really, really wanted views on his channel with a satirical board swap. And the latter day "satire" explanation is patently incongruous with the original context of their use and purpose.
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  10. 09-20-2019, 04:17 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by ersatz_cats View Post
    The point of whether arcade hardware can produce each and every one of these MAME signatures is the entire crux of the dispute. ...
    This is exactly why (in my opinion) one need more hypothesizes (not philosophy or own opinions). Too many own opinions exist on the forum thread without even trying to test out any other scenario setups not described here.

    In court one can proof that technically NOT all possible tests cases (hypothesizes) were completed therefore can one argue to execute ONE test case (one hypothesis - the one scenario Billy Team's description of how the technical setup could have been) is all option there really is using original arcade hardware with "something else"?

    To be honest, if I would have marked a Dissertation where a researcher only have completed ONE test, it is a fail for good!

    People opinions do not matter when scientific experimental evidence or counter experimental evidence are sought for. Was a null hypothesis done?


    This is how I do view the current case. So in "my books" (my view and not of the forum or TG), that this case is not closed.

    The only real constraints that the forum stick with are:
    - original arcade hardware
    - two bit converter
    - no changes done by either

    Was any other setup tested to counter proof or to support this claim?

    Let's say one can tune arcade hardware producing these non standard MAME fingerprints; (additional hypothesizes) then these would proof to show that "changing" original hardware is the only mechanism to produce MAME results, therefore the DK submission is invalid and not real with original PCB settings/tuning/connections (whatever those are).

    Off topic:
    I have to admit, to comment on @datagod 's opinion that too strong emotional language are used, I agree but there are merit in some of the views posted here. Their thinking and arguing both sides of the case. Which is an interesting read - just read between the lines and skip the strong language. See what the essence are. @datagod , hopefully you keep your sanity, you cannot fight the storm, just ride it out:

    "so be as wise as serpents and yet as harmless as doves"

    Some not always want to pick on you but show their frustrations.

    Another off topic bad thought from me:.....
    In some countries (I will not name any here), one's hand get chopped off if you steal, now I wonder what will happen to someone that is find guilty of cheating in a video game, chop of the left or right -hand. I am glad this is only a forum.
    streaming mspacman normal and turbo speed at: https://www.twitch.tv/francoisadt

    Francois du Toit
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