Dispute: Angela Stefanski - NES / FAMICOM / DISK - The Legend of Zelda - NTSC - Fastest Completion [1st Quest] - Player: Rodrigo Lopes - Score: 31:37.0

Is this a valid dispute?

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  1. Dispute: Angela Stefanski - NES / FAMICOM / DISK - The Legend of Zelda - NTSC - Fastest Completion [1st Quest] - Player: Rodrigo Lopes - Score: 31:37.0

    07-16-2019, 11:24 AM
    NES / FAMICOM / DISK - The Legend of Zelda - NTSC - Fastest Completion [1st Quest]
    Score Track
    https://www.twingalaxies.com/scores.php?scores=9607
    Rules
    Factory Default [1 Life Only! No saves allowed!]
    Special Rules: The timer begins when you hit start on the title screen and ends when you touch Zelda. UP+A on Controller 2 IS Allowed, but you may only use the Continue option! Entering Level 1, exiting and re-entering in quick succession to get the door to automatically open is BANNED! You must complete the game or your record/attempt will be disqualified.
    Player Name
    Rodrigo Lopes
    Original Adjudication
    N/A
    Verification Method
    Video
    Verification Date
    2006-07-09
    Disputed Score
    31:37.0 (Rank 1)
    Disputed By
    GibGirl
    Dispute Evidence / Rationale
    I'm opening a dispute for this time, not because I have specific evidence that it's not valid, but because of a number of factors listed below. I believe these give sufficient reason to consider this time questionable. I understand this may technically constitute a violation of the dispute rules, but I feel this is important enough to do so regardless, no matter the outcome.


    I believe the following factors all justify a dispute on this time:


    1) The game this speedrun is on is undoubtedly one of the top-tier games, not just in the speedrunning community, but in gaming in general. This elevates any speedrun times claimed to higher importance.


    2) This time represents a significant jump in efficiency in runs for this game, and not only would it stand as the best time for a number of years, but it looks like it would still be a world record for this specific category (Glitchless with Up+A allowed), though this may be just due to this ruleset not being run anymore. But it would likely be viewed as an "extraordinary run". In fact, even with years of increased understanding of the workings of the game and better strategies, nobody was able to approach this time for quite a while.


    3) I believe these first two items result in this being potentially a historically important run in speedrunning. And this is reason to give it extra attention.


    4) This time has been disputed by the speedrun community for a long time. Most do not consider it a valid run, as can be found in discussions about it elsewhere.


    5) Unfortunately, this record dates from a time where Twin Galaxies had questionable integrity. There is a reason that modern day Twin Galaxies requires a video submission that is archived for future reference.


    6) Rodrigo has repeatedly found reasons not to share a video of the full run. This is his imperative, given that at the time of his TG submission, it was not necessary. However, claiming a large accomplishment while not showing proof does not support his claim, especially for one that would make him noteworthy in speedrun history were he to provide the evidence.


    7) Finally, this reflects on how people view the integrity of Twin Galaxies at this time. Having score that the speedrun community does not find trustworthy listed as the top run for such a noteworthy game, without any corroborating evidence available to the public, harms the reputation of this site.
  2. 07-16-2019, 02:18 PM
    Since the picture upload isn't working on the site Im going to refer to a post @starcrytas made here in this dispute.

    https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthr...8=#post1044218

    If you read the comment Matthew posted of Rodrigo's statement on Zelda 1 he claims he can get a sub 30 in the game by using a better route and "getting luck bombs from monster drops". This means he has no idea about forced item drops and is still using antiquated strategies. There is no way that a person is gonna get a sub 30 in this game without complex knowledge of the game which Rodrigo clearly presented that he doesn't have with that post. Forced item drops are important because it makes it so you don't have to farm enemies for bombs and other items. Also, since this was submitted to Twin Galaxies that means there was no screenwraps used. I would challenge anybody to find a run under 30 minutes where the person is blindly relying on luck without using screenwraps.

    When it comes to video games one of the easiest ways to tell if someone is being full of bologna is when they show a lack of knowledge on the game.
  3. 07-16-2019, 07:02 PM
    I agree, this is very questionable and you bring up a lot of good points.
    Lauren Tyler
    Eternal Champion of Ragol
  4. 07-17-2019, 10:39 AM
    Timing ends when you touch Zelda. So according to the final moments, Rodrigo touched Zelda at 5:09, which means he had to enter Level 9 at 26:28.



    I once tried a savestated playthrough to get 26:28 or faster entering Level 9 without screenwarping, but I ended up with a mid 27 minute Level 9 start. However, my route and strategies most likely weren't the best.


    For those who are new to this discussion, the forum link below is the first mention of a 31:36 time. Must have been off on the timing since it's now a 31:37. Robert Mruczek @RTM verified this speedrun according to this forum thread here where Rodrigo states that Robert is his go to referee for all of his scores.
    https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthr...his-OWN!/page2
  5. 07-20-2019, 10:08 AM
    As there is no evidence available to view here - Lopes has refused to share any of his videos, and given the current TG dispute rules, he has no incentive to - and the time is theoretically possible, I feel that the best option here is to continue to show further circumstantial evidence of the questionable nature of this time.

    In this case, I'd like to compare other runs of his here on Twin Galaxies.

    His Zelda 2: The Adventures of Link time was over a minute and a half faster than the world record time of 59:43 on SDA up until it was beaten on 1/11/11.

    His Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past time was 3 minutes faster than the SDA world record as of 2005, unbeaten until 2009.

    His Super Mario Bros. time was 5 seconds off the SDA world record at the time of submission.

    His Super Mario World time 1 second behind the SDA world record at the time of submission.

    A speedrunner capable of competing at the highest levels in some of the most well-known, most-played, and most run games is *extraordinary*. Again, if these claims are true, it would make him stand out as one of the top speedrunners ever.

    Except... None of these have video available, and none have been recognized anywhere besides Twin Galaxies.
    Thanks Ninglendo, starcrytas, swaggers thanked this post
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  6. 07-20-2019, 01:23 PM
    Anyone who refuses to show their accomplishments are frauds. You won't change my mind.




    Found the song for this.

    Cheers.
    The Fisher King
  7. 07-20-2019, 03:50 PM
    To add to what @GibGirl posted:

    Link's Awakening


    Rodrigo - 1:22:57 in 2006
    https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthr...ore-01-22-57-0


    SDA - talk of 1:20:xx with segments, 1:30:xx single segment at the time
    https://forum.speeddemosarchive.com/...rogress25.html


    Link's Awakening DX


    Rodrigo - 1:36:11 in 2006
    Beaten in 2010
    https://www.twingalaxies.com/game/th...game-boy-color


    Even though both versions have speedrunning differences, in glitchless, it shouldn't matter much. But you'd think both times would be around the same.
  8. 07-22-2019, 12:41 AM
    I think if one look at a previous dispute of dragster where the theory and a computer based hardware model cannot make the time of a speedtrun it is questionable.

    To start with:
    - do we have a theoretical model of possible times according the source code and game behaviour

    Is it possible Lopes can do a fun run with close enough speedrun, like 32.00 will show he beats the current second place
    and is close enough proof the game run is doable and he do have the skills to do so?

    In the early days of TG, when a game score was questionable the gamer was asked to do a game run live
    which is close enough above the 2nd place score but not necessary a WR.
    streaming mspacman normal and turbo speed at: https://www.twitch.tv/francoisadt

    Francois du Toit
  9. 07-22-2019, 05:33 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by francoisadt View Post
    I think if one look at a previous dispute of dragster where the theory and a computer based hardware model cannot make the time of a speedtrun it is questionable.

    To start with:
    - do we have a theoretical model of possible times according the source code and game behaviour

    Is it possible Lopes can do a fun run with close enough speedrun, like 32.00 will show he beats the current second place
    and is close enough proof the game run is doable and he do have the skills to do so?

    In the early days of TG, when a game score was questionable the gamer was asked to do a game run live
    which is close enough above the 2nd place score but not necessary a WR.
    He stated 2-3 years ago that he still has the tape but claimed it would take too much time to convert VHS to digital. From my experience converting my old tapes to put online it took me less than a hour to do so.
    Thanks JJT_Defender thanked this post
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  10. 07-22-2019, 10:55 AM
    Rodrigo @Siliconian was able to convert VHS to digital seen here in his Famicom Goonies speedrun:



    There was also a Super Mario World speedrun he uploaded from a VHS recording, but it no longer exists.


    I guess Rodrigo never will post his speedruns. It's been years since this was posted:

    "More will come soon, my RPG World Records as Legend of Zelda series, Wild Arms, Phantasy Star, Ultima IV, Legend of Mana, Giga Wing 2, Wonderboy in Monster Land, Wonderboy III: The Dragon's Trap, Alex Kidd series and much more..."

    https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthr...l=1#post728249


    I'm sure if Rodrigo has any issues now with conversions, a simple Google search will help. I found many tutorials by simply searching "VHS to digital."
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