Dispute: Angela Stefanski - NES / FAMICOM / DISK - The Legend of Zelda - NTSC - Fastest Completion [1st Quest] - Player: Rodrigo Lopes - Score: 31:37.0

Is this a valid dispute?

    This poll is closed
This poll is closed
  1. 12-03-2019, 02:14 PM
    Haha, TG is screwed either way.

    1. They remove the scores, they screw up their ESI/CR/SP ratios a shitload UNLESS they take the time to correct that issue. So most are happy, but the after math of ESI/CR/SP is a roulette of outcomes and possibly crashes the site.

    2. TG only removes pre-TGSAP scores, most people are going to be in a huge uproar and the site pretty much loses some of its members. ESI/CR/SP mostly remains and the site doesn't crash but loses all credibility for not removing all evidence of a (possibly) found cheater and essentially "crashes" the site.

    3. @Siliconian uploads his run and prevents all of this from happening and theoretically saves TG from a demise brought on by his own actions. This scenario is of course the "dramatized" movie scenario where the villain becomes the hero in the end and benefits from his last ditch good deed and has his "haters" permanently banned. Of course Jace has to follow through on that claim or else he loses credibility for not being taken at his own word.

    So many paths to choose and they all back fire on TG. Up front the CR/ESI/SP scenario is nothing until we see what actually happens when it does. Maybe a Beta test behind the scenes to see what would happen if all of Rodrigo's scores where removed could be done before the apocalypse arrives. One thing I know for sure...
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  2. 12-03-2019, 03:31 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by thegamer1185 View Post
    3. @Siliconian uploads his run and prevents all of this from happening and theoretically saves TG from a demise brought on by his own actions. This scenario is of course the "dramatized" movie scenario where the villain becomes the hero in the end and benefits from his last ditch good deed and has his "haters" permanently banned. Of course Jace has to follow through on that claim or else he loses credibility for not being taken at his own word.
    Just gonna leave this here...

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    Thanks ersatz_cats, datagod, Lauren Tyler thanked this post
  3. 12-03-2019, 03:55 PM
    When did that happen? Nothing posted about a ban in here or anywhere else. Could this be them testing things out?? Or has this whole process finally started without an announcement?
  4. 12-03-2019, 03:58 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by thegamer1185 View Post
    When did that happen? Nothing posted about a ban in here or anywhere else. Could this be them testing things out?? Or has this whole process finally started without an announcement?
    Starting the process that way before doing anything more? A mistake? Something else?

    Regardless, it's easy to go look at his profile and see it's true, at least as of right now.
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  5. 12-03-2019, 06:42 PM
    Either they've started the process already, or something happened behind the scenes. Either way, it's curtains for him.
    Lauren Tyler
    Eternal Champion of Ragol
    Likes ersatz_cats liked this post
  6. 12-03-2019, 06:52 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by GibGirl View Post
    Starting the process that way before doing anything more? A mistake? Something else?

    Regardless, it's easy to go look at his profile and see it's true, at least as of right now.
    See @Jace Hall told us on a past episode of State of the Galaxies that a main focus will be about your profile page. Look at that.
  7. 12-03-2019, 08:15 PM
    After reviewing all of the objective and nearly definitive evidence presented in this dispute thread, Twin Galaxies still can not determine with absolute 100% legal certainty that the speed run performance result that is stored in the Twin Galaxies database for Rodrigo Lopes (@siliconian) is invalid.

    However, there are a number of additional and unique factors that Twin Galaxies has considered in its decision process:

    1.) The sheer mass of extensive, quality research and evidence contained in the dispute claim thread that is compelling, voluminous and clearly suggests a high probability of a misrepresented submission - and while it still does not completely rule out the possibility of performance validity, it definitely suggests that possibility is very remote.

    2.) The fact that the submitter, voluntarily, on numerous occasions stated that they are in possession of the original performance and that it can address any concerns - however the submitter will not provide the performance for reviewing purposes to help in clearing up this matter. Even upon special case Twin Galaxies personal request.

    3.) The fact that many non-anonymous people have invested a tremendous amount of time in this matter to determine the veracity of the dispute claim, including Twin Galaxies, with the goal of simply finding truth-in-fact to ensure scoreboard integrity - and the original submitter has shown no interest in assisting in any significant way, while at the same time repeatedly proclaiming that they are more than capable of doing so.

    4.) The fact that not only has the Submitter stated that they would not provide the tape of the performance to Twin Galaxies to assist in this matter, but also the submitter has stated that they plan on releasing the tape only after Twin Galaxies has made a decision. The Submitter purports to deliberately create a scenario where if Twin Galaxies were to decide to ban and remove the scores of the Submitter, the Submitter could then "embarrass" Twin Galaxies for making an error in its determination. This is perceived as a tactic specifically designed to discourage Twin Galaxies from making an unfavorable decision due to the remote possibility of being shown later to be "wrong."

    5.) The fact that the Submitter is a former Twin Galaxies Referee from a previous ownership era, and that title carries a historic responsibility and basic standard to uphold - but instead the Submitter has demonstrated a disregard for that standard within the Submitter's very own adjudicative matter here in this dispute claim thread. The Submitter is documented on many occasions asking others to provide proof and to substantiate their performance claims, but has demonstrated an unwillingness to specifically reciprocate in this very important dispute claim thread.

    Given the above considerations along with the entire evidentiary body of the dispute claim case, this is what Twin Galaxies has decided:

    a) Twin Galaxies can no longer stand behind the veracity of this specific speed run claim performance and it will be removed from the database.

    b) Rodrigo Lopes is banned (for reasons below) and all his scores will be removed.

    We have already banned Rodrigo, however there is some complexity in the score removal process so we want to do it carefully to minimize any effect or impact on other members.

    It will probably take us 24 hours or so to accomplish this.

    If in the meanwhile, Rodrigo Lopes wants to provide the video taped performance for review in this matter, he can upload it to youtube and send us a link.

    A final word:

    This is a highly unique situation (as most dispute cases are).

    To be clear, Twin Galaxies has not definitively determined if there was any cheating, and has no comment on Mr. Lopes personally in that regard. People can read the dispute claim thread and make up their own minds.

    This disputed score is being removed uniquely because of the combination of tremendous objective evidence against the performance claim combined with the fact that Mr. Lopes decided on his own accord to state multiple times that he was in possession of the video performance but refuses to provide it to assist with the situation.

    The rest of his scores are being removed because in addition to being subject to a very compelling speed run performance dispute claim against one of his submissions, Mr. Lopes is also a former Twin Galaxies Referee, has represented himself on this website as such (including within his account profile) and his behavior in this matter has been wholly unacceptable.

    Under normal circumstances, Mr. Lopes position might be understood. Submitter's are in fact under no obligation to re-prove their scores or supply information. Mr. Lopes was under no obligation to tell others that he had a video performance tape for this speed run performance. He volunteered that information on his own, for his own purposes. In fact, Mr. Lopes effectively taunts the dispute process deliberately as it relates to his claim to posses video footage that can dispel the dispute claim.

    Taunting a dispute claim case in the manner in which Mr. Lopes has, is not acceptable. People are there spending time, trying to authenticate and determine something legitimate. Going into the dispute claim thread, telling everyone that you have the answer, but won't share it, is not in the spirit of building community, or assuring Twin Galaxies scoreboard integrity.

    All of this is made worse by the fact that Mr. Lopes is a former Twin Galaxies Referee. From Twin Galaxies' perspective, Mr. Lopes position and behavior on this specific dispute claim matter had been completely unbecoming of the ideal behind what we believe a historical Twin Galaxies Referee should represent today or at least aspire toward. One would like to believe that if anyone would be more than willing to supply evidence to support a performance, or at least help Twin Galaxies with a difficult matter concerning them specifically, it would be that former Twin Galaxies Referee - as that is someone who has asked that of others many times and understands the importance of it. It has been disappointing to see that this is not the reality in this case.

    It is also important to point out that Mr. Lopes has expressed in this dispute thread that he feels unfairly attacked by "haters" and that if he were to provide evidence to dispel this dispute claim, there will simply be another one waiting to take its place and harass him further. He has expressed that he feels it is pointless to address the issue and sees no gain from doing so.

    In response to this, several members have stepped forward and placed their memberships on the line. They have been willing to accept a lifetime ban if Mr. Lopes were able to provide the performance tape that he claimed to posses. This definitely represents a "gain" to Mr. Lopes to help assure that future harassment might be reduced, if it were taking place, because those members would not be able to use the Twin Galaxies dispute system any further.

    All of this should not be necessary for a former Twin Galaxies Referee to feel comfortable supplying video evidence they announced they had on their own in the first place.

    There is no doubt that Mr. Lopes has historically contributed to Twin Galaxies in many ways, just as many others have, and for those contributions Twin Galaxies and its community are very grateful. Mr. Lopes has received public recognition in exchange for his accomplishments and Twin Galaxies has stood by the veracity of his performances historically. However, no amount of contribution can negate responsibility for action or behavior, and it is our collective responsibility to hold each other accountable so that we can truly build a great community and competitive database.

    It is unfortunate that Twin Galaxies must make this decision. We do not rejoice in any of this - and while it may not be probable, it is certainly possible that Mr. Lopes will later upload his performances to youtube or elsewhere that seemingly demonstrate that all his performance claims are valid. If he does, we will be happy for him unto himself, but we will always wonder why he was unwilling to simply do that here and now, not just for himself but for also the entire competitive gaming community that he can and should remain a part of.

    Thank you to everyone who participated passionately and honestly in this dispute claim thread.

    This matter shall remain closed until there is reason for it not to be.

    If you would like to continue the discussion, you can find the post-decision thread here:
    https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthread.php/211884-Post-Verdict-Dispute-Discussion-Dispute-Angela-Stefanski-NES-FAMICOM-DISK-The-Legend-of-Zelda-NTSC-Fastest-Completion-1st-Quest-Player-Rodrigo-Lopes-Score-31-37-0
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