Dispute: Luigi Ruffolo - Intellivision - Beamrider - NTSC/PAL - Default Settings - Player: Christian Dallari - Luigi Ruffolo

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  1. Dispute: Luigi Ruffolo - Intellivision - Beamrider - NTSC/PAL - Default Settings - Player: Christian Dallari - Luigi Ruffolo

    11-04-2021, 03:53 AM
    Intellivision - Beamrider - NTSC/PAL - Default Settings
    Track
    https://www.twingalaxies.com/scores.php?scores=2869
    Rank

    Rules
    This variation is for both NTSC and PAL as there is no difference between the two on the Intellivision Video Game Console.


    Player Name
    Christian Dallari
    Original Adjudication
    https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthread.php?t=220419
    Verification Method
    TGSAP
    Verification Date
    2020-09-04
    Disputed Score
    13,268,160 (Rank 1)
    Disputed By
    Luigi Ruffolo
    Dispute Evidence / Rationale
    This score needs to be moved to a PAL track. Read this thread for more info: https://www.twingalaxies.com/intelli...5#comment75069
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  2. 11-04-2021, 05:24 AM
    This is a track with 9 scores, 3 of which have no video. How are you proving if any of those 3 scores are PAL or NTSC? It seems the goal of this move is to move out a single score with no checks or balances as to the rest of the scores. Whether correct or not in it's assumption of PAL and NTSC being the same, the track rules clearly state either is fine. Seems the better solution is to create a new NTSC only track and submit new scores to that one (and you can submit your old TGSAP scores to that as well if your submission proves it is NTSC).
    Undisputed #1 Game Wave Family Entertainment Player
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  3. 11-04-2021, 05:50 AM
    Yes the rules do state that both are fine but it's conditional on them playing the same:

    "This variation is for both NTSC and PAL as there is no difference between the two on the Intellivision Video Game Console."

    As it's been found that there IS in fact a difference, any score that can be proven as NTSC or PAL should actually be moved to one of two separate new tracks. Those that can't be proven can just stay here. That's not tidy I know, but it doesn't assume anything and it doesn't keep anyone from submitting to any tracks where the rules are complied with. The idea that there'll be a new PAL track so all PAL submissions have to go there is the sketchy part if we're not handling ALL the scores on this track. I say create a PAL track and either "move" the PAL scores from this track to that one or remove and have the player resubmit. The resubmission would be proof of where the player wants their score to reside.

    We could always grandfather this current mixed track. I'm not in favor of that, though, because if the INTV player community cares enough about which version is being played then they can govern themselves and submit to the appropriate track.
  4. 11-04-2021, 06:05 AM
    I'm wondering if the ColecoVision has similar issues with some of its games (It has the same "This variation is for both NTSC & PAL...." in the rules).
    my pronouns: f/you.
  5. 11-04-2021, 10:31 AM
    This would not be on a game by game basis either. If the PAL vs NTSC Intellivision systems are different then the entire system would need to be reworked and there is no way of knowing if a lot of scores are NTSC or PAL. It is a big topic that will effect the all scores. And probably other systems that are listed as PAL & NTSC combined.
    Undisputed #1 Game Wave Family Entertainment Player
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  6. 11-04-2021, 04:42 PM
    Charles, is it not relevant that the “possible” PAL subs are the lowest scores on the track? For me it’s relevant.it’s not like a second place scorer who used PAL is getting screwed! That would be different!


    We can also use the following argument for accepting this dispute:

    The player Chris researched and investigated the issue - and prefers to submit using NTSC hardware and requests for his score to be removed. He doesn’t want the “advantage” of using the PAL hardware.
    @Chris 1-Bit please verify that this is correct. You’re not obligated to Re-submit your 13 million score on a new PAL track. That would be your decision to do so.

  7. 11-04-2021, 04:56 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Intellivision Master View Post
    Charles, is it not relevant that the “possible” PAL subs are the lowest scores on the track? For me it’s relevant.it’s not like a second place scorer who used PAL is getting screwed! That would be different!


    We can also use the following argument for accepting this dispute:

    The player Chris researched and investigated the issue - and prefers to submit using NTSC hardware and requests for his score to be removed. He doesn’t want the “advantage” of using the PAL hardware.
    @Chris 1-Bit please verify that this is correct. You’re not obligated to Re-submit your 13 million score on a new PAL track. That would be your decision to do so.

    True Chris is not obligated to re-submit his PAL scores, but the whole reason for setting up the PAL tracks is for his 3 scores yes? So if he doesn't re-submit them there then setting them up is a waste of time. Even though the PAL has been proven to play slower his scores are still incredible. I know damn well I couldn't score that high even if playing on a PAL console. So now what are we gonna do about the bevy of rules on the Intellivision platform that mistakingly say 'there's no difference between PAL and NTSC' when in some instances there clearly are differences? That to me could be a REAL problem going forward....
    ***A strange game. The only winning move is not to play. How about a nice game of Chess?***
  8. 11-04-2021, 05:01 PM
    I never said I want my scores to be removed as those scores are 100% legit.
    All considered the different gaming speed, I agree on the fact that it would be fair to have that scores in a PAL submission and create an NTSC only new submission.
    I also have an NTSC score to submit.
    That’s it
    Chris 1-Bit
  9. 11-04-2021, 07:34 PM
    If there's a difference with Beamrider, then how do we know whether there's a difference or not with other games?

    Abstaining.
    Lauren Tyler
    Eternal Champion of Ragol
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  10. 11-05-2021, 07:32 AM
    I’m not sure if some responses were to my point. I think Chris’ score should be moved to a new PAL track.

    I don’t think it’s relevant “if” any of the three beginner scores were done on PAL.

    It seemed clear to me that Chris, being the Beamrider Master wants to compare apples to apples and have his NTSC score on the main track. Not his PAL score.

    I have no objection to his PAL score being on a new PAL track.

    For transparency I’m voting YES on this dispute.

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