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02-25-2019 at 12:20 AM
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Finally had my submission that started on Aug 13, 2017 be REJECTED.

Yep, this is absolutely stupid, infuriating, and just plain wrong. I apologize to EVERYONE who voted on this the first 7 MONTHS it sat in the adjudication queue before the mandatory policy took effect. If it makes any of you feel better I took a hit as well. Oh yeah, the video was always up for viewing. Wish this had gotten pushed through like all the submissions being pushed through now. Maybe that whole grandfathering in submisisions before the policy was in place. Huge fucking mistake made by TG for not doing that. Just one damn thing after another on here.

Oh yeah, if you look in the link below I was asked if I could upload the video a few times. I had already started an entirely new submission that had the uploaded video in it. I stated that in the link below. So I didn't upload the video because the score had already been accepted with a submission that followed the rules. I know I said I was going to cancel it but I never did because at the time I wasn't sure if a cancel counted as CR. Also out of respect for everyone who had already voted on the submission, which was open for 7 months before the new upload policy I honestly thought it would be accepted.

Do I really have this shitty of luck on here? I must be submitting to much while every single issue TG has ever had has somehow applied to me, haha. Unreal.

  1. admin staff's Avatar

    Hi TheGamer

    I understand the frustration . Can you please suggest a solution ??


    Admin Staff

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  2. thegamer1185's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by admin staff

    Hi TheGamer

    I understand the frustration . Can you please suggest a solution ??


    Admin Staff

    Thank you for the reply. The same solution I have been stating since the new policy took effect. All submissions before that date should have been protected up to that point. Every single person has taken a hit because TG did not make that very simple rule. Everything in place now is because of that time when people couldn't upload to TG directly so anything will be argued that it's in place now.

    IMO the only correct thing to do is correct everyone's CR as if ALL those submissions with third party videos that where accepted/rejected after the new policy should be treated as if they never happened. And for those lucky submissions that did get accepted should remain in the database. This submission was perfectly within the rules for 7 months before that policy. It's not just this submission, there where many legit runs in the queue for months before that policy took place that somehow ended up being rejected because they weren't grandfathered in. That is why I say ALL submissions with third party evidence that where ACCEPTED/REJECTED after the policy need recalculated as if they never happened. Now submissions are being pushed through because I believe there aren't enough votes to pass them at this point and they haven't even been in the queue for 3 months. Probably the problem back then but I don't really know.

    This submission was an easy accept, easy CR, easy SP for everyone knowing I had already uploaded another submission with the exact same video uploaded. It's exactly like what Jared Oswald is doing now. He's resubmitting his scores of already accepted submissions. Which, IMO, is a classy thing and TG should give ANYONE who is willing to resubmit so the evidence is made permanent at TG free points to do so. After all, TG's uploading system was the reason many of us couldn't upload to begin with. Hell, I'd resubmit my stuff if TG gave me the points to do it. I don't want a single point more for it. I don't care if I have 12K SP points I could use. I hate doing things twice, and I'm definitely not doing things twice if the problem wasn't on my end AND the rules allowed it. However, I've always been willing to compromise and this would be fair to those us of had to use third party uploading. I think it's a fair compromise for TG to have the evidence becoming permanent as well. Helps legitimize the database.

    Just in case people don't like this idea because CR would be affected. Unless you voted 100% on all of these submissions, and never took a hit, you will come out ahead on this issue. If you got even 1 of these third party pre Apr 2018 submissions wrong, you lost 5% of your CR. No chance you have voted on enough of these "no video/not uploaded to TG directly" submissions to make up for that 5% CR you lost on that one single vote you got wrong. Everyone wins in this scenario. The upload issue would be a forgotten memory, TG would gain a little respect for correcting something that everyone was affected by. It sucked, for everyone. I believe everyone who has had a submission rejected because they didn't upload has either resubmitted, or is no longer here. So I guess people like me will have to eat the SP points we lost for the original submissions because some of them where rejected and we had to resubmit with the mandatory upload, but we will all gain the CR back we lost because of this ridiculous fiasco that had to have hit everyone at some point. I don't see how it didn't unless you just simply didn't vote on third party submissions. And for those who didn't vote on third party submissions, you have nothing to gain or lose by this solution. Literally, IMO everyone wins. TG gains a little respect back, the people who used third party videos get some compensation for resubmitting adding permanent evidence which is a plus the database, and EVERYONE WILL HAVE more CR even if they just took a single hit.

    Looks like a lot of work to me. However, when this policy first came out, if TG does some digging I'm pretty damn sure you will find I suggested grandfathering submissions prior to that mandatory policy quite a bit. Seems like a pretty damn good idea now I bet. I won't hold TG to anything one way or the other, the system has been in place for almost a year now so I doubt there will be anymore know, assuming the one I linked above is the last one.

    While I have your attention, any cancelled submissions should count as nothing. All cancelled submissions should have all CR hits returned as well. This I'm has happened to everyone as well. Either a submissions goes through adjudication by being accepted/rejected and CR is gained/lost, or it doesn't go through adjudication and therefore it's as if it never happened. More like, it never completed the process so the submissions was void, kind of like a contract. Lots of CR has been wrongfully lost due to the third party uploading issues/new policy and the cancel features.

    Updated 02-25-2019 at 01:11 AM by thegamer1185
  3. admin staff's Avatar

    I suggest the following solution

    Please identify the easy accept submissions that users uploaded before the "Video Upload Policy" was enforced .

    The submissions must be in accepted or rejected forums only .

    We will place all those submissions back in submission review for 10 days . Users who voted on those submissions must change or un-vote within 10 days .

    This will be fair for users who voted and users who added additional evidence after the policy was enforced . We will not allow any new votes on these submissions but allow users who already voted to change their votes .

    Do you think this is an acceptable solution?


    Admin Staff

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  4. thegamer1185's Avatar

    If this is as much as you can possibly do, then fair enough. Is there someway to indicate these submissions are in fact ones that have been reopened? With people uploading like crazy those submissions may get moved back in the queue pretty fast so some symbol/icon to at lease help identify them would be helpful. Just a suggestion. Thank you. Sincerely, Thank you.

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    Updated 02-25-2019 at 01:17 AM by thegamer1185
  5. admin staff's Avatar

    Hi Thegamer

    We cannot manipulate votes at all . Deleting the submissions as suggested by you will erase all the votes on those submissions which is considered manipulation. I hope you understand that .

    We will color code the reopened submissions once a comprehensive list is identified . I would suggest that the community decide on a deadline to identify these submissions .

    After the deadline we must now allow any further submissions to be moved or identified for reopening.

    If that is acceptable then we would request the community to work as a team and give us a final list of submissions to be reopened by 4th March ( this deadline date is just suggestion)

    I hope this made sense


    Admin Staff

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  6. thegamer1185's Avatar

    I guess I should have been more clear. I don't necessarily want anything removed/deleted, but if moving those accepted/rejected third party submissions somewhere that they gave back all the CR that people have lost because of them, while keeping the scores that did happen to be accepted would be ideal. I agree that simply deleting information is a bad idea. Just suggesting what I have thought, what others have said. Maybe waiting for some of the others to chime in would be best before anything is done. I'll tag as many as I can think of to get their views as well.

    @Barthax @starsoldier1 @starcrytas @Marcade @Marco @Snowflake @datagod @Blackflag82 @RTM @Conjured Entertainment @GibGirl @sdwyer138 @Pixe Sukola @RaGe @Ragequit @Ninglendo @timmell @Desidious

    I see you guys active more than most. Sorry if I missed anyone, feel free to tag them.

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  7. Barthax's Avatar

    So what's the plan exactly? Trawl the Accepted and Rejected forums for missing evidence threads? Or is it all third-party uploads?

  8. Snowflake's Avatar

    I hope I’m misreading but won’t the new submission screw anyone who rejected but is on vacation now. It’s bad enough to expect people to check for cancels now we have to check for reverse cancels as after the fact as well?

    Also who’s to say missing evidence was the only issue

    Now me I only abstained on third party never reject. Until after the rule of course when I did reject. So I probably won’t be affected but this feels wrong

  9. sdwyer138's Avatar

    It is frustrating to lose cred, and I'm sorry it happened to you, but this suggestion sounds incredibly time consuming, and will probably have wonky downstream effects.

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    Updated 02-25-2019 at 06:45 AM by sdwyer138
  10. Marco1019's Avatar

    FWIW, I took a CR hit:

  11. thegamer1185's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by sdwyer138

    It is frustrating to lose cred, and I'm sorry it happened to you, but this suggestion sounds incredibly time consuming, and will probably have wonky downstream effects.

    My suggestion or TG's suggestion? My suggestion was simply reverse everything done with those accepted/rejected third party submissions that where finalized in adjudication after that policy. So nothing would need to be done for any of the community. All scores accepted would remain in the database. Every single TG member that voted on third party submissions would come out ahead in CR at this point.

    The giving people free SP to upload direct evidence for already accepted third party submissions would be on the person who had to use third party. So myself, I would have to figure out which scores I wanted to reupload with evidence. It is my scores, and if I am willing to hope the youtube link remains forever, that risk is on me. Personally, now that I can direct upload I would gladly reupload if compensated for the reupload. Incredibly petty on my part, but the system was the issue, not my attempts to use the system and the failures that happened because of it.

    I do also agree with @Snowflake that if this is the solution, will people who don't change their votes be hit AGAIN with a 5% CR hit for not changing their vote? Or is this simply you are giving us the opportunity to make the correct change to gain 3 CR per corrected vote change? Will we get that 5% CR from each hit back based on our score at the time of rejection, or from our current score now? Either is better than none.

    If the answer to my last question is NO, then it's almost kind of a waste of time to allow us to change our votes for 3 CR each submission when we have probably lost 500 CR from a single wrong vote. It helps and I definitely appreciate TG is even considering this at this point. At this point, whatever TG decides is the best route, it's better than nothing and I'll accept what it is as long as there is no CR hits if you DON'T change your votes.

  12. Barthax's Avatar

    I expect the system only stores one vote per submission per person. So if you change your vote on a previously-completed submission you will undo your old vote. Even if "bringing them out of retirement" doesn't correct the CR, the daily sweeper task will recalculate.

  13. sdwyer138's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by thegamer1185

    My suggestion or TG's suggestion?

    Both, but primarily TG's.

    I'm not trying to wind you up here. I get where you are coming from. But here is the thing:

    Youtube submissions before the 'policy change' were really not that much safer from getting voted no than they were after the policy change. I sure didn't vote on them cause I knew the risk.

    I understand it was necessary for yourself and others due to the problems with the TG uploader. But man, once that got fixed, if I was you, I would have cancelled (giving notice for the benefit of the other members of course) anything I had in queue with a youtube link and made a new submission with a direct upload.

    If you had done that your sub would have gone through much faster and you wouldn't have lost the cred. You were just being very stubborn with the whole thing, rather than taking ownership of the situation.

    Again, not trying to wind you up, but it is what it is, and we need to let it go at this point. There's much more important stuff to focus on and try and fix around here. Your cred is fine, as long as you stay over 4K, I don't see what other personal benefit it holds.


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    Updated 02-25-2019 at 08:15 AM by sdwyer138
  14. thegamer1185's Avatar

    Fair enough. The link I did post above though I did resubmit with a direct upload. I just thought it would be shitty to those who actually voted. Especially now that we know for sure a cancelled submissions is treated as a rejected submission. Oh well, no worries getting me would up. Nothing really surprised me anymore. That's why I tagged many of you to begin with knowing my thoughts probably weren't the favored suggestions.

  15. EVN's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by admin staff

    Hi Thegamer

    We cannot manipulate votes at all . Deleting the submissions as suggested by you will erase all the votes on those submissions which is considered manipulation. I hope you understand that .

    You guys changed the submission rules with active adjudications in flight. How's that for manipulation?

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  16. Pixe Sukola's Avatar

    To be honest, your last comment months ago on that submission was "It's a duplicate of a score already accepted. It's been open for over a year. I'll just cancel it so nobody takes a hit. "

    Why didn't you at least unvote? That comment of yours stood for months before the submission got rejected, plenty of time for people to change to No. I think it was an honest mistake of yours and you should take the hit.

    I will support you in other matters if I think they are fair, I appreciate the tag.

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  17. thegamer1185's Avatar

    I honestly thought it would be accepted with my new submissions of the score already being accepted. And knowing if I did cancel the submission it would cause people who actually did vote accept on it would take a hit, I just left it open to be fair. That's pretty much it. The whole thing is a mess. Bad luck I guess. Thanks for the comment.

  18. Pixe Sukola's Avatar

    But you stated "I'll just cancel it" and in my opinion that fact puts all responsablity on you. I'm sure people who had voted Yes changed their vote when they saw your comment, I know I would have. And just to be clear I did not vote on that submission, Im not defending either side just commenting according to how I see thinbgs.

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  19. Snowflake's Avatar

    I agree with pixe, saying you’ll cancel is effectively asking fir a rejection. People didn’t reject cause of the rule they rejected because of your statement which makes sense cause lack of upload should just lead to abstain not reject

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  20. Pixe Sukola's Avatar

    Even Dave Hawksett commented on the submission months ago asking you to upload directly, people honestly thought you were canceling and changed votes dude, don't take it personal. And it is hard to notice changes in peoples cred all the time but we are all getting hit once in a while. I have lost 1,200 points just this year.

    And you said you have this score accepted so the only issue is the cred thing right?

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