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TWIN GALAXIES
12-12-2020 at 04:55 PM
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Decisions Needed?

Dear Community:

As it is becoming more difficult to keep track of all the various policy conversations that need specific TG Admin level decision making, this wall post is an attempt to ask the community for a concise list of each policy decision that is currently being discussed and needed.

If you are aware of such an issue, it would be helpful if you could clearly post a description of the issue and the current desired outcome (if any) to this wall post, along with whatever link/reference TG Admin can be directed to with more information if needed.

The goal here is to get these decisions made, and to continue to move the TG and the community forward in a positive direction.

This post is not intended to discuss site bugs or scoreboard errors. For that please click this link - https://www.twingalaxies.com/admin-staff/wall/3296/scoreboard-errors-website-errors-report-them-here



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  1. thegamer1185's Avatar

    This one needs addressed ASAP because it happens all the time. TG needs to just make it mandatory that every submission package needs to show a console boot up and hardware exposure. These things as of right now are not policy/required but many legit submissions are being rejected because they are not being shown, mostly by first time submitters. Adding to that, I've also noticed that most first time submitters never submit again. Honestly, I'd like all first time submitters to be allowed a one time free pass negating the above things I've asked just because most people familiar with gaming sites don't read policies and just submit their scores. It creates a more initial friendly atmosphere rather than the typical " No console or boot up shown, voting NO. I recommend reading the policies section or watching other videos." I'm sorry, but many come off as high and mighty when saying it because emotions can't be easily interpreted through words. It's all from a good place, but I think you all know what I mean.

    Since Direct Capture submissions can't show consoles, a picture of the setup should be required in each upload as well. This won't take much time so the inconvenience level is minimal compared to the hassle it presents for some adjudicators.

    Speaking of first time submitters, I think each new member should be allowed 5 free uploads to get them started. Many don't stay around long enough to see how the process actually works because their submissions may sit to long which they don't understand that's how the process works, or the initial negative feed back (it's positive feedback but appears negative to most) from their first submission is off putting and they have immediate way to resubmit. That pushes them to yet another system in TGSAP that they don't understand out of the gate and gives them more reason to just not deal with it.

    I believe these changes fixes the confusion of Boot Up/Hardware exposure and also makes the place much more new user friendly and more people will stick around.

  2. thegamer1185's Avatar

    Also, FPGA systems being included in Original Hardware submissions vs EMU submissions. Just trying to bring that topic over to this thread.

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  3. Barthax's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by thegamer1185

    Since Direct Capture submissions can't show consoles, a picture of the setup should be required in each upload as well. This won't take much time so the inconvenience level is minimal compared to the hassle it presents for some adjudicators.

    This does not make sense for many, many submissions, even where photos are used. There's no way to link the photo to confirm the current submission is using the equipment in the photo and will likely (if not already) lead to people using third-party photos.

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  4. Barthax's Avatar

    Manually-timed runs.

    Back in the days of VHS submissions, manually timed runs were performed by the referee. Over the years it has become obvious that multiple different tactics were used to perform the timings and has lead to confusion during TGSAP. There doesn't seem to be a "right way". The pasts' methodology would always be timed to a second boundary (rounded, truncated, or whatever) and not sub-second. The rules do not reflect this where there is already legacy scores on the scoreboard. With the ideology of a fair and level playing field, could TG make a decision on:

    - Updating legacy manually-timed tracks to reflect the need for times bound to the accuracy of one second.

    - Make a formal decision on how timing should be performed for legacy tracks.

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  5. thegamer1185's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by Barthax


    This does not make sense for many, many submissions, even where photos are used. There's no way to link the photo to confirm the current submission is using the equipment in the photo and will likely (if not already) lead to people using third-party photos.

    And yet people still ask for them....so in a way it makes a whole bunch of sense:P I completely agree with you, but this is what is being asked in almost EVERY SINGLE SUBMISSION that is direct captured by a newer TG member. I don't get it either because anyone can just find one off the internet and claim it as there's, yet it still happens...all the time. And it's been discussed numerous times so I'm bringing it here.

    LikesBarthax liked this post
    Updated 12-15-2020 at 11:09 PM by thegamer1185
  6. Barthax's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by thegamer1185

    Also, FPGA systems being included in Original Hardware submissions vs EMU submissions. Just trying to bring that topic over to this thread.

    TG has separated these in the past (JROK springs to my mind) & there's was some movement towards using a CLONE - prefix instead of the usual NTSC/PAL/EMU options. Such tracks should be included in any decision.

    Examples:

    NES: Kabuki Quantum Fighter, Kick Master, Bubble Bobble

    Mega Drive: Alien Storm, Altered Beast.

  7. Barthax's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by thegamer1185


    And yet people still ask for them....so in a way it makes a whole bunch of sense:P I completely agree with you, but this is what is being asked in almost EVERY SINGLE SUBMISSION that is direct capture that is by a newer TG member. I don't get it either because anyone just find one off the internet and claim it as there's and yet it still happens, all the time. And it's been discussed numerous times so I'm bring it here.

    Oh, absolutely. However, there's no mileage in TG mandating an arbitrary photo to appease personal perceptions.

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  8. thegamer1185's Avatar

    I completely agree with you, but there are quite a few members who are not on board with direct capture because it's easier to cheat without a video showing the hardware. That's their argument. Don't worry, I have built it...they will come.

  9. Snowflake's Avatar

    showing the console only helps rule out honest mistakes it does ZERO to rule out cheating. showing or not showing the console doesnt even make it a little bit harder or easier to intentionally cheat. unless you take the time to actually show the wires and that the console is hooked up to the tv in question, then nothing is accomplished. i give into showing it cause its easy enough and not worth the fight, but thats really all it does those two things. 1. avoids a fight with people who insist on it 2. rules out honest mistakes -- and there have indeed been honest mistakes caught due to showing the video so it does have that merit.

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  10. Barthax's Avatar

    Another side to the console originality debate: what constitutes "original console" from the rules? Some separate submission types throw light on the debate of "original console":

    - Using a Nintendo Wii to run PAL GameCube games on an NTSC Wii via Nintendont software (many submissions accepted): https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthread.php/200185-Nintendo-Game-Cube-Crash-Bandicoot-The-Wrath-of-Cortex-PAL-Time-Trial-06-Jungle-Rumble-Fastest-Time-01-06-06-Matthew-Felix

    - Setting "pin 200" on an NTSC Mega Drive to run PAL games at close-to PAL speed: https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthread.php/224478-Sega-Genesis-Sega-Mega-Drive-Thunder-Force-IV?p=1104476&viewfull=1#post1104476

    - Using XECUTOR2 (spelling?) on an NTSC Xbox to run PAL region games: https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthread.php/218716-Xbox-Battle-Engine-Aquila-PAL-Episode-2-00-Interception-Fastest-S-Grade-Victory-01-08-0-Kyle-Nelson

    - Setting the PS2 region via third-party loader before loading a game: https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthread.php/199171-PlayStation-2-Gran-Turismo-3-A-Spec-PAL-Arcade-Mode-Class-A-Mid-Field-Raceway-Fastest-Lap-01-16-851-Adrian-Burrell

    - Using an original PAL console nativey capable of PAL-60 to submit NTSC (has happened many times pre-TGSAP). My own Rayman Raving Rabbids TV Party subs such as https://www.twingalaxies.com/game/rayman-raving-rabbids-tv-party/nintendo-wii/ntsc-shake-it-tv-abc/ (pre-TGSAP was OK with this - can probably have the footage somewhere if needed).

    - Using an original PAL console natively capable of 60Hz HDMI to submit NTSC: https://www.twingalaxies.com/showthread.php/146682

    ... and there are plenty of known possibilities on numerous other consoles such as the regionless Sega Master System and Philips Videopac/Magnavox Odyssey 2.

    Thanksbensweeneyonbass, thegamer1185 thanked this post
    Updated 12-26-2020 at 03:20 PM by Barthax
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